Dudley has now forfeited their entire season and the Panthers will now be listed as (0-10) for 2014…One year probation for Dudley, Southeast Guilford and High Point Andrews….
*****Football coaches at all three schools, Dudley, Southeast Guilford and High Point Andrews have been reprimanded by the NCHSAA…*****
+++++The following schools were found to be in violation by the Guilford County Schools:Dudley, Southeast Guilford, High Point Andrews, Northeast Guilford, Western Guilford, Ragsdale and Page…..+++++
(This is a lot to digest in one sitting but have at it.)
Release from the Guilford County Schools:www.gcsnc.com
Nov. 25, 2014 – Guilford County Schools found violations with football programs at seven high schools, after conducting a detailed review of North Carolina High School Athletic Association (NCHSAA) requirements. GCS reported the violations to the NCHSAA on Monday, Nov. 24.
As a result of the review and the violations found, three football programs – Dudley, Andrews and Southeast High schools – were placed on probation for one year and their head coaches were reprimanded by the NCHSAA.
Four other high schools – Northeast, Western, Ragsdale and Page – were fined for failing to complete required paperwork. The NCHSAA also reprimanded the football programs at Western, Ragsdale and Page.
District Athletic Director Leigh Hebbard and other staff did the review of all 15 high school football programs after discovering eligibility issues at Dudley High School earlier this month. After the review, GCS learned at least one ineligible player dressed out for all Dudley High School’s varsity games; Dudley will now forfeit its entire 2014 football season.
The player was on the junior varsity team, but also dressed out for all 10 varsity competitions and took the field in at least four. According to NCHSAA rules, student-athletes who are juniors may not participate in more than one game within one week. NCHSAA rules say that dressing out for a game is the same as participating.
These nine violations are in addition to the one reported after the Southeast High game on Nov. 7, which Dudley forfeited and which kept the school out of the playoffs. Dudley will pay a $500 fine for each violation (for a total of $4,500 in additional fines; the school already paid a $500 fine for the Nov. 7 violation) and will forfeit those games, which means the school forfeits the entire season. In addition, the NCHSAA reprimanded the head coach and placed the football program on probation for one year.
“I’m disappointed to discover these additional violations,” said Jesse Pratt, Dudley High’s principal. “At Dudley High, I expect our staff and students to play by the rules in the classroom and on the athletic field. I will be taking immediate action to ensure these issues will not happen again. This is unfair to our students, our student-athletes, our staff and community, and I am sorry for everything we have learned over the past few weeks.”
Dudley and the six other high schools – Andrews, Southeast, Northeast, Western, Ragsdale and Page – failed to complete required paperwork related to the NCHSAA’s eight-quarter rule.
The eight-quarter rule allows freshman and sophomore junior varsity football players to participate in the JV game as well as the varsity game in the same week. The NCHSAA requires two forms to be filled out as part of the process: the first form must be submitted before the student plays in the varsity game.
In addition to being signed by the student’s parent, athletic director and coach, the team’s licensed athletic trainer or physician also has to evaluate the student and sign the form to ensure there are no health concerns before the student may play in a second game in one week.
Failing to fill out the advance form results in a $500 penalty per game. The association will not reduce the fine related to the advance paperwork, because it is critically important to ensure students are evaluated physically before taking the field in two games in one week.
The Monday after the game, an additional form must be completed on the NCHSAA website, listing any players who participated in the eight-quarter program, as well as the number of quarters in which the student-athlete played.
Andrews did not fill out the pre- or post-game paperwork for nine games, for a total of $4,500 in fines. The NCHSAA also reprimanded the head coach and placed the football program on probation for one year. In addition, the school forfeits all nine games and must return to the NCHSAA any money earned during the 2014 playoffs.
Southeast reported seven violations for failing to complete the pre-game paperwork, for a total of $3,500 in fines. The school did complete the post-game paperwork. The head coach was formally reprimanded and the football program was placed on probation for one year.
Four other schools – Northeast, Western, Ragsdale and Page High schools – also reported violations for the post-game paperwork, but all four did complete the important pre-game forms, which include the medical evaluation. Western, Ragsdale and Page face a one-time $500 fine and their football programs were reprimanded. The NCHSAA waived Northeast High’s fine due to internal changes the school made before the football season ended.
The eight-quarter athletic violations by school are as follows:
CLICK HERE to see all of the info:
School
Violation – Pre-Game Paperwork
Violation – Post-Game Paperwork
Total Fines
Andrews
Nine games: $4,500
Nine games
$4,500
Southeast
Seven games: $3,500
No violation
$3,500
Northeast
No violation
$500 flat fee
Waived
Western
No violation
$500 flat fee
$500
Ragsdale
No violation
$500 flat fee
$500
Page
No violation
$500 flat fee
$500
School High Point Andrews:Violation – Pre-Game Paperwork(Nine games: ($4,500):Violation – Post-Game Paperwork( Nine games):Total Fines($4,500)…
School Southeast Guilford:Violation – Pre-Game Paperwork:( Seven games: $3,500):Violation – Post-Game Paperwork(No violation):Total Fines($3,500)…
School Northeast Guilford:Violation – Pre-Game Paperwork(No violation):Violation – Post-Game Paperwork($500 flat fee):Total Fines(Waived)
School Western Guilford:Violation – Pre-Game Paperwork(No violation):Violation – Post-Game Paperwork( $500 flat fee):Total Fines($500)
School Ragsdale:Violation – Pre-Game Paperwork(No violation):Violation – Post-Game Paperwork( $500 flat fee):Total Fines($500)
School Page: Violation – Pre-Game Paperwork(No violation):Violation – Post-Game Paperwork($500 flat fee):Total Fines($500)
“I’m disappointed to find schools were not following the rules,” said GCS Athletic Director Leigh Hebbard. “This is not new information, and we expect coaches and athletic directors to know and follow NCHSAA rules governing their sports.”
All head football coaches are required to attend a mandatory NCHSAA rules clinic every summer. Athletic directors receive updates, information and reminders about association rules throughout the year, and the district athletic director reviews any changes with athletic directors prior to the start of each season as well. Athletic directors are expected to present an NCHSAA powerpoint to all coaches every year; the presentation provides a review of attendance, academic and residency rules, as well as regulations governing eligibility.
As a result of these issues, school athletic directors will now receive additional training on the NCHSAA policies and procedures. Hebbard also will work individually with the schools that had the greatest number of issues. In addition, Hebbard will develop a district-wide protocol to handle the eight-quarter rule and how it is reported and tracked in the future.
SEG, if your house is made of glass then it would not be wise to throw stones……#Paperchamps
I say fire Guilford County AD!! He’s disappointed but not taking any responsibility. Terrible leadership!
Wow, this is very disappointing. It will be interesting to see who takes responsibility or is scapegoated at each school. I do know the AD at WG is in over his head.
It wouldn’t be surprising if he was the one who dropped the ball at WG.
I agree with the above poster that the county a.d. has a LOT to account for. Way too many violations during his tenure.
Let’s be careful with our comments here…I know everyone has a strong opinion on this topic and this a very touchy subject, but let’s all be careful with what we say and how we say it…..
Gonna be some angst out there, but we still have to respect our leaders that are currently in charge….
Would not be surprised to see some changes around the county prior the next school year and not sure where they might come from, but have a feeling that change is on the way or a better way to phrase this might be to say reform is on the way in…..Reform or change, action is forthcoming to some degree….
Agree with you Andy! Sorry for the harsh words! You said it much better.
Not for sure who is getting the money from the fines here, if it is the county(GCS) or the state(NCHSAA), but we are talking somewhere in the neighborhood of $14,500 in total fines here….
We have a good crowd here in this forum….A very good crowd of participants that know their community and their community resources well…
And I know it is now time for lunch and we have basketball on our plate for tonight, right???
What does “probation” mean? Will they be able to play football next year? Will they be able to go to playoffs?
Early ‘theory of mind’ says here that they will be in a mode where every detail of the operations of their football programs will be under tight scrutiny for that one year period…Everything you do must be near-perfect in the way you conduct your program…
Did not see any specifications about any of our teams having their programs shut down or being banned from post-season play….That may be spelled out in more detail later on, but for now you are not locked up in your room entirely, you can go out and play, but you have to make sure the way you play is within all of the State(NCHSAA) and County(GCS) guidelines….
Others may have more to say on this one….
Where are all the Dudley bashers at now. Southeast reported something and then it backfired at the entire county. Funny thing is why is it coming out now that they lost in an early exit. Real classy Mr. Hebbard ( Southeast alum).
The amount of paperwork that these coaches have to have their players fill out in GCS is INSANE!. Each kid has a Physical, 3 proofs of residence, and a 4 page book that says they are who they say they are just to play. Plus the 8 quarter pre-and-post paper work. Plus have a trainer sign some more paper work. Every HC in Guilford County have to teach a full day and grade papers first. Then keep up with all this paper work is a lot when you start thinking of 80-130 kids on each football team (I know not all are 8 Quarter kids). So before everyone says they should fire all these guys relax.
Every HC is not a teacher. But those who are, are under great deal of paperwork. That’s why you have assistants and athletic directors. Checks and balances. If the HC drops the ball then the AD should catch it. AD’s don’t teach all day.
Which HC in Guilford County is not a Teacher? I thought they had to be a teacher to be a HC in Guilford County.
Do you think an AD is going to catch every problem with paper work. Most schools play more sports than Football. Most people want to sit here and throw stones but if you walked a day in the shoes of these HCs and ADs you would see just how much they have to deal with. All I’m saying is give a little grace people!
Now when we are talking about Jr’s playing JV and Varsity that’s a different story. Something needs to be done. But pre, post, trainer paper work plus parents to sign. Plus the NCHSAA website. Plus teaching and grading papers plus most are Husbands and Fathers. Plus GCS Football coaches are some of the lowest paid in the Country. They do all this for an extra 3-5K a year
Huge difference between what Dudley did and 4 of the other schools. First, those schools did not have to forfeit games. They did not cheat or play illegal players. They did however fail to turn in post game paperwork. Shame on the AD’s at these schools. Dudley situation is a little different. They had to forfeit every game. Plus Dudley had juniors out there. The ther schools failed to turn in paperwork n freshmen and sophomores. Huge difference.. Very disappointed In my Tigers. My son filled that paperwork. AD has to get that turned in. This isn’t a new rule.
Every head football coach in GC teaches a full load. The paperwork is really not that much involved in the 8 quarter process. All of the pre practice paperwork (proofs of residence, etc) is taken care of before a kid is allowed to practice. If you have a good system in place the process goes by much smoother. Most schools have player-parent meetings with the AD at the beginning of FB practice. If they don’t attend and get this paperwork out of the way they don’t practice until all these forms are complete. Normally the AD takes care of this. The 8 quarter paperwork is taken care of by the AD, HC and AT. FB Fan, if the AD has a good system in place the answer is yes he will catch 99% of the problems. The fact is the 8 Quarter paperwork is the simplest of them all to see that everything is turned in properly. The AD, HC and AT at EG do an outstanding job with all of this because they have a system that makes it easy. That is why you don’t see the name Eastern Guilford HS liosted.
Disappointed, you are right. The HC needs to get that turned in to AD so s/he can turn it in. My son filled it out too. System in place. Rusty Lee is a great AD. He trains ADs in nation and state. HC can’t keep records to himself. Looks like GCS is fixing it. Knows what needs to be done and can fix it.
ALL HCs need to turn that paperwork over to ADs. ADs are trusting that they will do that. They are checking paperwork from parents but must get paperwork from HCs too. They cant keep it. I guess this is a wake up call for HCs and all. So sad for so many players. What happens to those on probation?
Warhead is exactly right. I’m a former Varsity HC in Guilford County and the standard is very high in GC. It is a lot to keep up with. You almost need a secretary. The high school I coached at is not listed as one that got caught. I now Truly appreciate the extremely tight ship the AD ran. guess that’s why they are not in hot water.
after the forfeits who is the Metro conference champ?
Smith is now the Metro Champion closely followed by Grimsley. They are now going to start the playoffs over again with Smith, Grimsley, and Southern Alamance in.
Grimsley now has a better record than Dudley, SEG, AND Page.
Gfan 4-1-14
Don’t matter how much you make at any job. You get paid you should be able to get fired!!!! Tell your teenager tomorrow when they go to their part time job “you only get paid min wage don’t worry about rules and violation” also you have all that homework and projects no way you can do a goodj job.. Like I said WOW what are we teaching our kids? Everybody else does it? You have to much to do its ok to do half @@@ job? Somebody else will do it don’t worry about it? Look in the mirror and say these things to yourself. And say ‘self do you believe me” See what kind of answer you get
Do the kids a favor if you cheat and violate rules. QUIT!!!!!!!!
I heard thru the grapevine that a rep w/ the chicago bulls will be in town on the 3rd of December – scouting for players and hanging out at the Battleground Inn.
TO @DUDLEY: I have no dog in this pillow fight, but I’m tired of the Dudley people who keep calling Leigh Hebbard a Southeast alumnus. The guy went to HS somewhere in the Eastern part of the state, maybe Pitt County, and he was AD, wrestling coach and assistant principal at Eastern Guilford and a teacher at Andrews. He didn’t go to Southeast and has never worked there. Perpetuating that rumor when you know it’s untrue is like perpetuating the rumors about all the Dudley athletes who don’t live in the Dudley attendance zone and are no longer enrolled in the Academy or a magnet program (some never were), yet are allowed to stay at Dudley because they play football or basketball.
First off Gfan, SEG did not have to forfeit any games, only Dudley did. I have been a high school football coach for a long time, and I can tell everybody on here that the pregame paperwork is the responsibility of the athletic trainer to be turned in to the AD, period. This is a $ grab by the NCHSAA for the fines to be so high. The pre game paperwork is nothing more than a clerical error that should not cost 500 dollars a game. Don;t confuse this with what Dudley did. Playing Juniors down on JV to win the conference, dressing them every Friday night and playing them in some of those games. Then having the head coach lie and then backtrack at 100 mph every time more info about the violations came out. SE and the other schools should be punished and take responsibility in full for their mistakes, clerical or not. However, the amount of the fines levied by the NCHSAA for any of these schools is insane
People still fail to realize that dudley did not cheat on varsity. they played one junior on jv, yeah that’s cheating on jv, but when he got in on varsity it was when dudley was already up big. Dudley earned their varsity wins hands down. I’m not in the dudley community but that’s just my take on it.
Dudley had one junior on jv. He wasn’t even the main running back. The starter was a sophomore. Without him, the jv would’ve went undefeated still. As far as the varsity, he barely sniffed the field. People want to turn this into a cheating matter when you can’t win. Now all of a sudden Dudley has all these players out of district. Those kids are in the academy just like other schools have. It’s not Dudleys fault that these kids know that these other schools just want to use them and when they’re done, not send them to school. Don’t think a FULL investigation was done. They would’ve found that if that were a problem.
I haven’t seen anyone mention one course of action that would alleviate much of this paperwork, which is to reduce the reporting requirement by cutting the number of kids that need to be reported under the 8 quarter rule. The rules clearly state that the 8 quarter exception is for emergency depth purposes. My strong belief is that for most schools, especially the 3A/4A schools, it is used more as an opportunity to get younger players experience at the varsity level, by letting them play a few plays at the end of lopsided games. So, if the coaches insist on using the 8 quarter exception to their advantage (and it is an advantage, though not necessarily in that game, but for the future), then they have to take responsibility for following the reporting rules.
Dudley is the only team that forfeited games and their record falls to (0-10)…
(Let’s add in HP Andrews that forfeits 9 games too.) Got to read that fine print and we all do, you know…
No, Andy. Andrews also forfeited games. Nine of them. Interesting that both of Guilford County’s 2013 state champions had to forfeit all of their wins this year.
Yes, I missed that part on High Point Andrews and went back and did a re-read….This is a lot to digest and to take in ….
Something tells me that after the day we had yesterday with Ty Graves traveling(by plane and not on the basketball court) with the announcement from the GCS, and with all of the basketball games coming in last night, today, the day before the Annual Turkey Bowl, today will be a quiet day….
High Point Andrews was checking in at (5-6) to end the year before the forfeitures and I wonder does this now put them at (2-9), or what would their record be based on the nine games where they messed up, were those already losses, or do those now become losses and could they be something other than (2-9) with a possible (0-11)….
Any high school basketball games going tonight and let’s not lose sight on the fact that we still have Northern Guilford at Orange and Southern Guilford at home vs. Eastern Wayne, in the playoffs this Friday night…
And we should really champion our schools and our AD’s that made it through the rain this week….
With the forfeit of games Andrews is 0-11 for the season.
Andrews should not have to forfeit Endowment game.
No jv’s allowed that week. So juniors could play legally. Still have to 8 qtr frosh and sophs.
JD it is interesting that both 2013 state champs from Guilford had to forfeit all those games.
Are they checking on practicing during the dead periods and spring practices with more than 21 players?
Oh now we are going to blame the trainer…PLEEEEAAAASSSEE people. The buck stops at the head coach. The rules are not that hard to follow. My biggest concern in all this is the coach that lied (or at least did not investigate) over and over each time getting deeper and deeper into this. Grown ups would have looked carefully at their programs when all this got stirred up, come clean, and do the right thing.
I am not just pointing at Dudley here. All the coaches in the county should have done this and not waited to get nailed by the investigation that you KNEW this was coming. Did you really think that Dudley was not going to point an everybody does it finger? Blame who you will but we all know who is ultimately responsible for this mess and the kids paid the price for your ignorance.
at first it was one game. and the excuse was “we moved him up because JV season was over”. later in the week it became five games. now it’s all ten games. it’s sad when a program that operates so efficiently on the field is either totally clueless to the eligibility rules or chooses to ignore them. now wondering if eligibility and 8-quarter audits of the 2013 season might turn up more violations (and I mean all Guilford County schools). congratulations to all of the Guilford County Schools (coaches and athletic directors) who had NO violations.
Well I think the proper sanctions were handed down here and even brought out some issues at several other schools. But for SE to be spiteful because they got tired of losing on the field………I mean really what did you expect to accomplish here? You will still have to see Dudley next season.
If John Primm was County Athletic Director he would hold a meeting with Every coach and AD in the county to make sure they were compliant, or at least heading in that direction. He would call a meeting in the spring, have dinner, and talk about what needs to be done. He would make sure the coaches got all of their paper work in to the proper authorities. John was my AD at NEHS. He and Tommy were glued to the hip as far as guidelines were concerned. This whole process is a matter of taking time, being thorough, and meticulous. It seems as though some programs dont have that ethic. AD,s coaches have to work together to make this work. You also have to have a “big boss” to make sure that the “little bosses are getting the right information out.
Dudley did not chest like everybody saying. They played a junior on I’ve and dress him on Friday. And when that junior got in all the games were blowouts. So next year with our 17 starters coming back. We the scores get like 60 to 0 don’t nobody say Dudley have no class. And especially southeast.
Gfan, actually if it’s a paperwork issue the buck stops with the AD. If illegal players were used its a HC issue. AD files the paperwork.
@ Dudley Fan – have you passed an English class?
I’m with NWGHS fan, how about we find a way to simplify the process?
Also, if a player dresses but doesn’t play, should that count against the 8 quarters? I feel it shouldn’t.
Let’s the coaches give the JV kids the chance to experience the atmosphere without risking their health.
Once they play in 8 quarters, then they become varsity, period. No back and forth.
And the comment about the Western AD being in over his head… where did that come from? We have a student athlete that attends middle-college but we live in the Western district and our student participates in varsity Western sports. The AD helped us work out a few scheduling conflicts and is very responsive and supportive. Not filing post-game paperwork doesn’t qualify as being in over his head.
The fact that more than half the schools had no violations indicates the process is not that complicated. Why do they need to dumb it down? I would think next season there be 100% compliance after all of the negative publicity along with the fines. But one would think with Northern forfeiting 2 games last season because of confusion over the 8-quarter rule that everyone would have read up on that and all other eligibility rules. I will say this, any AD or head coach that fails to fully comply with all eligibility rules next season should be removed from their position – NO doubt!
MIM, glad to hear your experience with the WG A.D. has been a good one. Not saying he is a bad guy but he is not a good A.D. Ask the coaching staff, other schools coaches and a.d.’s.
I’m not shocked it happened, that’s all. Jim Clontz is sorely missed and he ran a tight ship all while dealing with major health issues.
Hopefully the county can get this sorted and put it behind them. I hate it that kids have to suffer consequences when adults make mistakes like these.
MIM, frosh and sophs do not have a quarter against them if they don’t play in the varsity game. But the paperwork must be completed. Also limited to only 12 frosh and sophs. A soph can play jv all year and dress out on Friday all year if one of the designated 12. Once participation in 8 qtrs. varsity only.
Juniors however can only play one game per week. Dressing out a junior equals playing.
This is good for the kids. Tell the truth,do your work that you get paid to do,don’t cheat,and always check behind others if your name is involved!!! And last but not least their are consequenseces for not following the RULES!!!!!!!!
The kids and parents know also. Most of these kids are 16 or older they know if there in district, how many games they’ve played in and have read that other schools in the past have been caught…
They also know what $500 is and how hard it is to come by,but if you dont mind paying a few extra taxes each year break the RULES!!!!!